Or…”a Lutheran Piety”.
Join Pastor Mark for the first in a 3 part series on ‘The Faith Toolbox’.
In this first class, Pastor Mark outlines the 5 key points to ‘a Lutheran Piety’.
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click here The Lutheran Understanding the Christian Life (Part 1)
Points 1 – 3 are covered in this installment. Points 4 and 5 will be covered in part 2.
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Thanks Pastor Mark!
And thanks to flickr, and Terrible_Swede, for the photo of Luther’s Rose.
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Filed under: Lutheran Piety, Pastor Mark Anderson |
The Old Adam Lives! 
This is a question for either you Steve or Pastor Mark: In the lesson today about piety you used the term “free will” in regard to calvinists and I believe it was in reference to the calvinist view of baptism. I am wondering if you are familiar with what is called the covenental theology of dutch calvinism which teaches that baptism is a sign given to the infant of their entering into the visible community of God’s people with the promise of the parents to then raise them in the nurture and admonition of the Lord. This then is ideally followed by a time in the life of the child when they stand before the congregation to make “confession of faith” and are recieved into the membership status of the church, partaking of communion etc. I have been raised in the teaching of the Christian Reformed Church in which this theological view was held. In my understanding the point at which the person made a “confession of faith” was never understood as the free will of the person being exercised but rather the appearing of faith in that person’s life which God had brought to the individual within the promises of their baptism. I know, I haven’t asked a question yet but wanted to bring some background to where I’m at. I am no longer part of the CRC, haven’t been for 40 years. I am now attending a Lutheran church, asking questions of the Pastor and reading and listening to everything on this site. I am “nearly” convinced of the Lutheran teaching on baptism but am trying to square its statement that God “made a decision for you in baptism” with my earlier experience in dutch calvinsism. I don’t know, guess I forgot what my question was except, could you respond to what you believe is the difference between those two views? I just never heard the calvinists I have been around try to defend free will. All I ever heard about was our total depravity and bondage of our will to sin. Also, if either of you know where the quote from Forde is from in the message on knowing God’s wiill, I would appreciate knowing that. Thanks, and I look forward to the rest of the class on piety.
Good input Ronh… I’m looking forward to Pastors response to your observations and question.
Hi Ronh,
I think Pastor Mark refered to the fact that he was painting with a very broad brush, and that Calvinists vary greatly in their views of the Sacraments.
I think he was saying, and i hope he would correct me if I’m wrong, that where the Sacrament aren’t viewed as the real presence of Christ, that it ultimately boils down to a humanistic view of the will.
I have seen this inn Calvinists that profess that we don’t have free-will.
But their lack of confidence or trust that Christ is actually in what He commended us to do, belies their profession (of no free-will).
My 2 cents, anyway.
Thanks, Ronh.
Good stuff at the link below, Ronh.
Forde does a great job of laying out the differences of Reformed, Catholic, and Lutheran views.
Go here:
http://books.google.com/books?id=dLl4JOeELkAC&pg=PA166&lpg=PA166&dq=forde+on+baptism&source=bl&ots=tSBWJvj6u-&sig=Fglutw4Y2hd0eqQ7Jplu2A-hdIw&hl=en&ei=V6ONTsPsN8SLsgKWw8WhAQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=5&ved=0CDAQ6AEwBA#v=onepage&q=forde%20on%20baptism&f=false
Thanks, Pastor.
I absolutely loved those paragraphs by Forde on Baptism.
Thanks to both of you for the links to check out. You guys, actually its the probably the Lord, are really shaking up my view of the sacraments right now and I’m starting to agree with it. Keep up the good work as you labor to get this message out to the church community at large. I mean “labor” only in the sense of it being hard work and unpopular.